Submitted by Syd Nicholson on Thu, 12/21/2006 - 00:00
Forums
IceBreak

Do any of you guys know anything about the Microsoft implementation of Ajax called Atlas?

I read somewhere that Atlas consists of javascript code and objects to simplify Ajax implementations. I have seen some conficting reports:

1. That the implementation includes all required cross browser software in any OS (eg. Windows, Linux, Mac)  -- or

2. That the implemtation is Microsoft specific and only supports IE running in Windows. The implementation only supports Microsoft .NET servers.

If option 1 is true - then Atlas could prove to be very useful. If option 2 is true, the usefulness of Atlas is limited.

Does anybody know if Atlas supports cross browser usage, and is it compatible with IceBreak?

Regards
Syd

Hi Syd,


 Originally Posted by Syd Nicholson: 
"Yes, I did try a google search - that is where all this confusion came from.

I kind of hoping somebody might have experience of Atlas with IceBreak and Mozilla or Opera."

I can't say that I have implemented Atlas in IceBreak, but I have tried it out. First of all you should find out what exactly it is that you need? Is it just the Ajax requests or the UI? Atlas is HUGE if you just want the Ajax request stuff.

I haven't tried it all but what I have tried it looks like it is working in IE, Firefox, Opera on Windows and Firefox on Linux. I haven't tried anything else. I should work with IceBreak, PHP, Java, ASP.net, ...

I'm constantly following up on - and trying - most of the Ajax implementations out there and I think that the UI stuff in Atlas is slow. They do have some nice UI controls.

What is is that you want? If it is the UI then what exactly do you need? Grids, Drop-downs, split panels, tabs, ...?

Best regards,

John Foldager
www.izone.dk
www.icebreakforum.org

Thanks John,

I am hoping that some of the controls will simplify my development - especially cross browser stuff.

There are features in IE that do not exist in Mozilla, etc - eg. onpropertychange(). Trying to work round these things is very time consumming. Already I have decided that my client's project implementation will be IE only in order to reduce time and costs. If they decide to use other browsers in the future, they will need to pay for the modifications at that time.

I am, however, concerned about the changes in IE7. I havn't tried this broswer yet (I don't have enough PCs!!) and think that Atlas might help.

I am not too worried about the UI - I tend to use FrontPage at the moment because MS Visual Studio is noticably quite a bit slower. At the moment Frontpage makes development more productive.

It doesn't surprise me that it is slow. Java/JavaScript objects take time to biuld and require CPU power as well as memory. Also large scripts take time to load from the server. Once the objects have been built it should not be too bad, but every time a new session/page is started the user might experience performance issues, especially on slow coms lines or underpowered PCs.

I would prefer to avoid a performance issues but time/costs are more important at the moment.

Regards
Syd

 Originally Posted by Syd Nicholson: 
"There are features in IE that do not exist in Mozilla, etc - eg. onpropertychange(). Trying to work round these things is very time consumming. Already I have decided that my client's project implementation will be IE only in order to reduce time and costs. If they decide to use other browsers in the future, they will need to pay for the modifications at that time."

Do you use onpropertychange() ? I can only quote Microsoft's own page for this:

"There is no public standard that applies to this event."
 

Wel... when you do it the Microsoft way just remember that -- when the time comes - it will(!!!) - when you have to do cross-browser -- IE does not work as expected when you try to access attributes vs. properties and values! Just FYI!

Best regards,

John Foldager
www.izone.dk
www.icebreakforum.org

Hi John,

Yes I am aware of the problems of being too proprietry - I need to balance this against my client's budget.

I use the onpropertychange() event in the following scenario.


I have created a 'custom drop down box' containing a list of customers and addresses. The box is loaded using AJAX. I use a custom drop box because the customer list is too big (>32K) and loading of the standard drop down box fails. Using Ajax I can load the 'custom' version a page at a time and add search facilities.

This drop down box is a separate HTML page, and when a customer is selected it updates a text field in the parent HTML page that called it.

The parent HTML page contains various text fields used for searching for a specific entry in the Client's Job Book. When the customer text field in the parent HTML page has a value, the 'Search' button must be enabled. This is achieved using the onpropertychange() event.

Only the onpropertychange() event works in this instance, the other 'on*' events rely on direct user input, whereas in this case, the value has been set by another web page.

I haven't found a siutable way of doing this in Mozilla and/or Opera yet. I am still hunting.

Regards
Syd

Hi Syd,


 Originally Posted by Syd Nicholson: 
"Only the onpropertychange() event works in this instance, the other 'on*' events rely on direct user input, whereas in this case, the value has been set by another web page.

I haven't found a siutable way of doing this in Mozilla and/or Opera yet. I am still hunting."

In this scenario I would probably have created a updateCustomer(argument(s)) function in the main page and call this from the popup. This new function should then set the correct value(s) in the fields(s) based on the arguments and at the same time disable the search button. Furthmore, it might be a really good thing in this function to prompt the user if this is really what he/she wants before overriding existing data.

This way you will not use any proprietary methods.

Best regards,

John Foldager
www.izone.dk
www.icebreakforum.org

Gents;

ATLAS is Microsoft's implementation of AJAX - which i both cool - but also bulky (3000+ lines of JS). They have implemented so it is possible to run AJAX even where activeX and native httprequest is disabled - by dynamically loading hidden IFRAME's with JavaScript ... amazing .. but - again - bulky.

MS have decided to rename ATLAS back to just AJAX to avoid the confusion.

IceBreak has on the other hand a tiny - yet powerful AJAX implementation, and it very far from ATLAS.

ATLAS can, however, be migrated to IceBreak, but it is like shooting sparrows with cannons.

Niels

 Originally Posted by Niels Liisberg: 
"ATLAS is Microsoft's implementation of AJAX - which i both cool - but also bulky (3000+ lines of JS). They have implemented so it is possible to run AJAX even where activeX and native httprequest is disabled - by dynamically loading hidden IFRAME's with JavaScript ... amazing .. but - again - bulky."

Multiple implementations use iframes from cross-domain Ajax access... so it can be a good thing 


 Originally Posted by Niels Liisberg: 
"IceBreak has on the other hand a tiny - yet powerful AJAX implementation, and it very far from ATLAS."

The main difference is that Atlas has UI "widgets". IceBreak does not.


 Originally Posted by Niels Liisberg: 
"ATLAS can, however, be migrated to IceBreak, but it is like shooting sparrows with cannons."

Still... it depends on what you need... just Ajax request/response or the whole UI thing... and remember... other APIs have UI stuff too... if you do not like the Microsoft way... 

Best regards,

John Foldager
www.izone.dk
www.icebreakforum.org